Kitchen Table Chats #48 – Homesteading Outreach, Sourdough Before Bed, and Gifts Again!

What We Talked About:

Andrea’s Camp-Outs

Spelt and Chocolate at Lunch

Briana’s Question: My Church wants to do an outreach for our community … it sounds like homesteading skills are something that would be part of this… Any ideas what things non-ancestral living people would like to learn? Either to save money, or if they have an interest in homesteading.

Rebecca’s Question: When you’re reading aloud in the evening or reading aloud for homeschool lessons, do you do voices for characters?

Amy’s Question: Any tips/recipes for starting a sourdough whole grain loaf in the evening that would be ready to bake in the morning? Maybe that’s wishful thinking…!

Revisiting the Gift Question: The importance of experiences!

Andrea’s Question: Body odor and do we live in a vortex?

Resources Mentioned:

Meagan Francis’s book, The Last Parenting Book You’ll Ever Read

Naomi Devlin, BREAD: Gluten Free

Not mentioned in the episode, but mentioned in Discord: The Complete Tightwad Gazette

Transcript:

Alison:
Hello, Andrea.

Andrea:
Hello, Alison. How’s it going over here?

Alison:
For another KTC. Yeah, we’re okay here. We’re okay. Lots of things happening in life and probably by the time we record the next KTC, we might be in a different house, but that’s a long story and far too traumatic to go into at the moment. But yeah, I’m looking out the window at the pear tree and I think maybe I’ll have a different view next time we record. So how are things your end?

Andrea:
You’ve been pretty good. Yeah, we’ve been busy. We’ve been, let’s see, as of the time of this recording, we’ve been doing pretty much back-to-back big campouts that we were hosting for different groups in our life. And I think they’re all wrapped up now. And the day after they wrapped up, Gary brought the tractors down and started ripping up the area working on the next project that we’re working on.

Alison:
Does he ever stop?

Andrea:
No, he doesn’t. But we’re doing some water conservation, basically building space to capture more water. And that’s always a good thing to have going. So, anyways, couldn’t work on that until everybody was gone because it’s basically going to trash the area, turn it into a mud pit. So, mud pit’s beginning, winter’s coming. I feel the Anglo-Saxon dread of the cold.

Alison:
Right now me too my i have a jumper on yeah all my summer stuff is just getting packed away and the thermal leggings are out and the jumper is on is rob impervious to the cold yeah absolutely gary yeah he doesn’t know when it’s cold yeah okay just like he’s they’re useless there a hot water bottle at all times and in all places and can go outside with just like a t-shirt on how do they do that.

Andrea:
Yeah Gary will say you’re pushing me off the edge of the bed and I’m like I’m just trying to get warm.

Alison:
Yeah exactly just.

Andrea:
Trying to heat up over here.

Alison:
Yeah not my fault I’ve got.

Andrea:
I’ve got jeans on sweatpants over that sweatshirt two hot.

Alison:
Water bottles oh my gosh oh my gosh that is cold a cup of.

Andrea:
Hot milk and coffee so.

Alison:
That is pretty cozy over here yeah that sounds nice did you eat something or is the coffee your breakfast mmm.

Andrea:
The coffee will not be my breakfast. That shall not sustain me. But I have not eaten yet this morning. But last night, I basically had steak and potato salad because we’re eating leftovers from the camp out.

Alison:
Wow.

Andrea:
Good leftovers. Kind of be feasting for a little bit. We’ve got a little salmon, a little steak. We’ll serve on turf. So, yeah. Sounds delicious. And how about you?

Alison:
Yeah. I made a duck liver pate this morning.

Andrea:
Oh, duck liver.

Alison:
I saw a packet of duck livers at the market on Saturday. We haven’t had liver pate for a while. Gable’s just, oh, it’s harder and harder to get him to eat liver. Really? Yeah, liver pate is usually reliable. So I saw the duck liver and I thought, oh, I get that. And then I think we’ve had this conversation before. I used to make liver pate in like ridiculous quantities you know like a kilogram of liver I don’t do that anymore I’ve let go of that addiction you’re a changed woman exactly um I got up really early this morning and before like people were moving around and I just thought I’ll start this um pate Rob got up to he chopped me an onion because I’m struggling with my arms at the moment so he’s doing quite a lot of the shopping for me of the hard stuff um and onion I always control my knife on the onion one day I’ll learn like French chef knife skills and I’ll get a really good knife but for the moment it’s just me with my old knife doing it.

Alison:
The cack-handed way as I always do anyway so he chopped me some onions I fried those and then I was just in the kitchen doing other bits and bobs and as I was in there I was doing everything that was needed for the pate so I fried the onions first of all in some lard then put them in a bowl then I did the mushrooms when they were done put them in the bowl then I did some bacon when that was done put it in the bowl then I did the duck liver when that was done put it in the bowl then i just left it on the side did something else actually went out with gable for a little while.

Alison:
And by the time i came back it was nicely cooled down put the food processor together whizzed it all up um with a bit of butter and a bit of water and then there was three portions there so i put two in the fridge for today and tomorrow and one in the freezer because it freezes absolutely brilliant liver patty is a wonderful thing to freeze it’s so easy to freeze and it comes out completely unchanged in my opinion um i agree and then we had um spelt sourdough which was a special spelt sourdough which had toasted sesame seeds in it um there’s a supporter who i’m doing mentoring with who’s doing mentoring with.

Alison:
Me at the moment and she loves putting sesame seeds in her breads and i thought i want to give that a go i think sesame seeds would go really nicely with spelt and so i toasted up a load of sesame seeds that i’m completely addicted to now i’m putting them on everything because the taste so good and i put them in the spelt and then sprinkled some on the top and it tastes really lovely so we had um the spelt sourdough which i toasted because i love to have the liver pate with toast rather than just normal you know bread and then i was just finding what other vegetables i could in the fridge so we had some carrot batons and some cucumber and then there’s a little bit of cauliflower left which i cooked so i had cauliflower on the side and then i had a square of homemade chocolate before i came up to record which was very nice so.

Andrea:
Neither of us is going hungry.

Alison:
No that’s for sure we kind of had.

Andrea:
Luxurious chocolate steak We could kind of have luxurious meals, too.

Alison:
Yeah. It’s nice to have a bit of luxury.

Andrea:
Which is fun to have in the middle of the week, you know? Just like, yeah. It is a good feeling.

Alison:
Exactly.

Andrea:
Well, that sounds very good. I really want to get more into adding seeds and things into breads because it is one of my favorite things, like a really seedy bread, either topping or mix-ins. I just love that.

Alison:
I think it’s sometimes hard because, you know, we’re pushed for time and bread can just be something that for me, I’ve been doing it for so long that we can just, you know, once we’ve got a loaf under our belts, as it were, we can just throw it out, get it done, do it without even thinking. And that means when it comes to making a change even if it’s something as simple as putting some seeds in it it kind of means we need to think about it yeah that’s a struggle for me sometimes turn my brain on please yeah exactly the way to get around it really is to just for me i found was to toast those sesame seeds and do a ton of them and then put them in a little container in the cupboard and then all you have to do is get the container out and just throw some in the bread doesn’t matter how many does it you know just just don’t even need the scales just get the thing out throw it in the dough before you mix it but if those seeds weren’t toasted ready I wouldn’t do it so I think if you want to use some toasted toast you know find some time when you want to listen to us maybe in the kitchen um and toast those seeds and get them all ready and then um then you can just throw them in without with minimal thinking that’s my yeah that’s my plan And.

Andrea:
Sesame seeds are so nice and light that I feel like they don’t take as much thought as maybe trying to mix in walnuts or something like that.

Alison:
Well, they inspired me to make some granola. Well, actually, what happened was, we’ve got time to go into this because it’s a KTC, haven’t we? Tell me I’ve got time to talk.

Andrea:
I love the KTCs for that.

Alison:
Rob and I went away for our anniversary, just for one night. And someone cooked breakfast for us, which is just a… Once in a blue moon i mean more than once and once in a i don’t know whatever anything something that’s less than a blue every so often as a blue moon anyway um and whilst i was having that breakfast i saw there was some sugar-free granola a packet of it on the side i didn’t have any but i thought that’s interesting i’ve always kind of avoided granola because it’s always got sugar in i thought but maybe maybe it doesn’t matter maybe i don’t need to have sugar in it so i am, I came home and I sprouted some buckwheat and then roasted it and I did a load again so it’s just in a container in the cupboard and then I spread a tray out with some of these sesame seeds and some sunflower seeds and some hazelnuts I chopped and some rolled oats and I put that in the oven at quite a low temperature just to kind of lightly brown it for quite a while and then I put that in a container and put some of the sprouted buckwheaties in it and stirred it around and it’s really nice wow really nice you don’t need to have um to have sugar for me because i’m used to not having sugar so i’m not necessarily looking for a sugar hit from my granola anyway it’s just that crunch you know and all the toasted flavor of like the hazelnuts and the seeds along with the kind of the.

Alison:
Um okay the sustained the sustainingness of the oats as well you know and the buckwheat is all crunchy really really nice so it’s good having a good idea and.

Andrea:
Not not sweet granola.

Alison:
Yeah because.

Andrea:
I’m also thinking if you made like a big buttery bowl of oatmeal and you put some of that crumbly crunchy stuff on.

Alison:
Top that’d be very satisfying yeah i said that to gabriel i said we could have some porridge oats you know some um oatmeal as you’d call it and sprinkle some of that on the top just to bring that kind of crunch to something that’s not crunchy which is really nice yeah.

Andrea:
There’s something about texture in food i know we’ve talked about before.

Alison:
That sometimes just.

Andrea:
Adding in a little hint of that crispiness it’s just so rewarding.

Alison:
And i think it’s also good for us because you know without something to chew we’re not necessarily pushed to use our jaws as much and therefore we’re not necessarily going to produce the same amount of amylase in our saliva to digest those carbohydrates but if we put a bit of a crunch in there it’s going to force us to chew a bit more and therefore we’re probably going to produce more enzymes in our saliva which is a good thing absolutely.

Andrea:
You’ll digest better then you’ll sleep better.

Alison:
Yeah see.

Andrea:
We need granola.

Alison:
Yeah yeah yeah completely basically.

Andrea:
The key well we’ve.

Alison:
Got some.

Andrea:
Really good questions today yes.

Alison:
We have you’re ready to tackle them yeah i’ll read the first one and then you can you can read the others i think okay so this one’s from um brianna um i think she put it on the discord forum um for us to tackle so it’s quite a long one i’ll read it through she says my church wanted to do an outreach ministry for our community it’s unfortunately a financially struggling area my pastor mentioned a few times about single parents and wanting to show them ways to save money with kids’ clothing. From other conversations in the past, it sounds like homesteading skills are something that would also be part of this. I had the idea for the title of this ministry to be Homestead Where You Are At, which I think is a great title. I had ideas for visible mending. And she said, like, turn that oops into a story. Turning adult shirts into kids clothing. I can turn a button down. I can turn a button down into a dress and a pants set. Really nice. Turn a quilt into a jacket. you can come over here Brianna and do that for me please for cooking I thought bread making call the bread the minute interval bread so people here think the whole two hours to make things means two hours hands-on okay so she’s basically saying let’s call the bread a minute interval bread rather than oh this is gonna take me two hours of my life to fix this bread right.

Alison:
She’s also said granola protein bars seasoning mixes baked goods mixes like pancakes cakes and waffles so the question is any ideas as mums yourself what other things do you think the non-ancestral living people would like to learn either to save money they do not have or for an interest in homesteading but things that they perhaps feel right now are kind of out of their reach or not doable i think it’s a great idea oh yeah.

Andrea:
I think this is a great idea well you could this is a free thing that you could do at every class is um, just have them all download the episode ways to save money because not all of those will be feasible for somebody but.

Alison:
Some of them might yeah so that’s.

Andrea:
A thought and that’s free you know it’s.

Alison:
Basically a.

Andrea:
Little workshop for free. I wanted to read real quick a comment that another Discord member left. Her name’s Rebecca. And it kind of fits in with what she said about the -minute interval bread. So I just want to read this because I thought it was really good. So Rebecca said, On the topic of time in the kitchen, I timed myself mixing up bread dough this morning, and it took me a grand total of eight whole minutes. I’ll probably need to find an additional eight to minutes later today for shaping the loaves and getting them in the oven. At the end of today, I’ll have two loaves of sandwich bread, which is enough for my family for the whole week. Obviously, there’s passive time waiting for the dough to proof and bake, but minutes seems like a pretty good time investment to me. I think these tasks like baking bread and making stock, preserving fruits and vegetables, etc. Seem onerous and demanding only because most people don’t do them and talk about these tasks as if only the heroic among us could possibly achieve them baking bread is spoken of in odd tones as if it is some kind of alchemy but that’s only because it’s not normalized we normalize lots of other tasks and make time for them why not bread yeah.

Alison:
minute bread i mean literally, That’s what it is. It takes minutes. It’s just a way of looking at it.

Andrea:
Isn’t it? Yeah. Out here, each of those loaves of bread would sell for $ in a grocery store, much less, you know, fresh like that. So, you know, that’s pretty insane.

Alison:
I think the baked good mixes are good. And I really particularly like the idea of pancakes because I’m a pancake fan. But, you know, pancakes are so easy to make. and if people are intimidated by bread literally if they have a mix already made up and they can make up tons of that if it’s dry do you know they can make up enough for like six weeks.

Alison:
And then literally what they’ve got to do is turn the pan in put a bit of fat in it and put some water in that mix and put it in the pan and so that that’s a true that’s not intimidating i feel i feel like the same with oatmeal i feel like you know oatmeal is so nutritious and so simple and you know you can literally set it with the instant pot you can set it up the night before you can just put it in a saucepan with water in it and leave it overnight to soak and then in the morning all you’ve got to do is to either turn that instant pot on or turn the heat on on your saucepan and you can make three times as much and put it in the fridge and get it out and heat it the next day you know i remember um francine in australia saying on discord that she does her oats in the instant pot and she makes enough for two days and she cooks it and then she just leaves the second day in that pot on the side and then the next day she heats up and serves it now these people may not have an instant pot but literally you can make three days worth of porridge and put the other two days in the fridge then spoon it out the next day back into a saucepan with a bit of extra water, heat it up, and you’ve got breakfast in like two minutes, you know?

Andrea:
Yeah. I think that’s a good idea. The thing that makes her question a little tough is she says, you know, what do you think non-ancestral living people would like to learn? Because really, you know, let’s learn how to make oat cakes. That’s pretty much about the cheapest thing you can make. And that can go beside anything. And when we had… The camping group here over the weekend, I made them without, so we had someone who he’s very strictly gluten-free. And so I couldn’t put in sourdough starter. And he’s very strictly dairy-free, so I couldn’t put in like kefir or whey. And he’s very strictly apple-free. He can’t have apples, so I couldn’t put in apple cider vinegar. So we literally just ground up the oats and mixed them with water. And guess what? They were so delicious. We shaved a little tiny bit of nutmeg on them. We sprinkled it like a little bit of cinnamon on them, just a touch. And I had salt in the mixture, of course. And then we cooked them in lard because he can do lard. And he just couldn’t get over how delicious they were.

Alison:
So that’s the Staffordshire pancake recipe, is it?

Andrea:
Yes.

Alison:
From the Meals and Ancestral Hearth. So, yeah, if you went to look at that, Brianna, the Staffordshire oat cake, that recipe is fermented in the book. But as andrew has just said and as i have actually done when i’ve just wanted pancakes and not had time to not have the thought for to do them the night before you can just put water so you could just literally have oats salt water and then fry them it’s so simple and then because you don’t even need a mix for that you know you’ve literally just got your oats and then you put a bit of salt in it and mix it with some water and cook it so it’s really economical because oats are so economical um and then it’s really simple really simple.

Andrea:
Well well i guess my question is for brianna is to what extent does she think you know that that’s how to make a staffordshire oat cake which is.

Alison:
A very.

Andrea:
Filling hearty quick side dish that you could pair with like a very simple soup or stew, or whatever. But, What I have found sometimes is people don’t want something that they aren’t familiar with. So they say, no, what I want to know is how to make the thing I’m used to like the way I’m used to it for cheaper.

Alison:
Like white bread or something like that.

Andrea:
Right, right. And so then having to accommodate where they’re at beginning, but knowing that they’re so far. Like, if somebody could get bulk oats and make the oat recipes out of your book, for instance, I mean, they would be saving so much money on so many of these expensive type, you know, like the little oatmeal packets or breakfast foods that people make. And they’d be way more full, you know, what did that quote say? Like, they didn’t want the wind to go through the ribs or something like that.

Alison:
Yeah, yeah.

Andrea:
Like the food that really keeps you going, but it’s a culture shift for a lot of people. And that’s actually the hardest part.

Alison:
Yeah.

Andrea:
So, so Brianna, if you were going to have like a sequence or series of classes, which is actually also quite difficult for people in some like economically depressed areas, because usually everybody’s working. And so getting them to come you know once a month to a class when their shift might be on one month and off another month is really tough i totally get that but if there’s a way that you could just keep plugging away at you know modern lifestyle is made to sell us lots of expensive products and then they we we’re told that they’re doing us a favor by making some of the expensive ones for cheaper, but still, it’s an expensive product, as you and I know, since we don’t buy them. But just continuing to educate on that all the time so that they’re being exposed to these ideas, I think, would be the best thing ever. But it takes a long, slow time. But you know what? People are smart. People are really smart if you are talking about these ideas they’ll start to settle in and people will start to figure it out.

Alison:
Yeah in people working at different times like we’ve talked about you know some people sometimes people are receptive sometimes they’re not and so, those moments where someone is receptive if you can provide them with some information then then you’re potentially changing their life which is amazing i mean just dropping the idea.

Andrea:
That might bubble back up for them years later but.

Alison:
I was thinking about chicken and the idea of you know well some of them might be you know thinking that buying some chicken breasts is a kind of treat for their family but the idea of buying a whole chicken and our chicken episode that we’ve got you know way back in the annals the whole chicken and nothing but the chicken the idea of, buying a whole chicken presenting them with those prices this is how much a whole chicken costs and this is what you can get from it and this is how much a chicken breast costs and there’s just no comparison and all you have to do is put that chicken you know in in a stock pot for a couple of hours and and you’ve got all of this meat and you’ve got all of the stock yeah it’s not it’s not difficult to do that again it’s one of those things that’s not hands-on and you don’t have to do anything with you sort of put it in the stock pot yeah you know and i’m i mean i’ve.

Andrea:
Talked to multiple people who have said they’ve never handled or seen a whole chicken ever.

Alison:
And these aren’t people who don’t.

Andrea:
Cook these are people.

Alison:
Amazing yeah.

Andrea:
And it’s just.

Alison:
So i think.

Andrea:
It’s even less a part of our culture than we’re fully aware of.

Alison:
Because again.

Andrea:
Like if you go into discord probably half the people will say they’ve butchered one and you know.

Alison:
So so.

Andrea:
You’re kind of in this bubble where people but did any of us start there like how many whole chickens had you cooked at the age of like probably not a lot.

Alison:
So like.

Andrea:
We all had to come in and learn these things but um but it is, generally speaking, less prevalent than we probably think. But gosh, a whole chicken. I was thinking when she said, what are other things non-ancestual living people would like to learn? I think that…

Andrea:
I have found something that’s catching very much onto mainstream is bone broth. People are hearing about broth and they’re seeing people talk about it and they’re seeing really expensive products being sold, like freeze-dried powdered broth and bottled broth and things like that. And if you could teach people how to go to, like, the butcher department or a butcher shop and ask, do you sell bones do you have bones can i get bones um and then showing them how to make broth at home i’m just thinking about how much protein that is and how for us for the longest time we didn’t have like muscle meat hardly at all because it was just the muscle expense of the quality i wanted was just kind of too far out of our budget but we had broth all the time and then we would have organ meats when we could get our hands on them so it kind of sustained us and then eventually we were able to get more meat down the road but but the broth was there for us you know and yeah, even if they’re making broth from a very you know factory type animal it’s still going to be better than no broth at all yeah and it’s also going to start giving them that taste for the good things and the homemade things yeah just to not even necessarily.

Alison:
To drink it but just to put it in you know when they’re cooking rice or cooking any other type of grain.

Andrea:
Right because.

Alison:
Then the flavor isn’t so it’s not like the flavor hit you get from a cup of broth is quite something but if you.

Andrea:
Use that broth.

Alison:
Um instead of water to cook your grains then you’re slowly customizing potentially people in the house who wouldn’t drink broth to it which is good.

Andrea:
Yeah that’s a good point i think we’ve had a few discord list or listeners whatever discord writers who have said you know such discord peeps, who’ve said you know such and so in my house doesn’t drink broth but but that’s not a problem you cook rice in it you know you cook pasta in it even or i use broth to make a soup gravy, hey maybe making gravy would be a good skill that’s a very simple thing but if you can make a good gravy you can make dinner out of anything you know.

Alison:
I’m a bit, I don’t know, every time I think about you and gravy now, I just think about gravy and biscuits. And I just, just someone from Europe is like, gravy and biscuits, what?

Andrea:
Anyway. Sorry, the American doesn’t British over here. So we struggle.

Alison:
I think the mending stuff is really.

Andrea:
Just gravy on rice. Gravy on rice is, that’s a delicious one.

Alison:
I was going to say, I think the mending stuff that Brianna, I mean, that’s something that Brianna loves doing. And she’s absolutely wonderful at, you know, seeing some of the things that she creates on the calls and also in Discord. And the idea of doing a simple kind of visible mending, you know, to bring life back to something that potentially might be thrown away and do it in a way that’s actually making a statement and looking quite funky is really nice. So I think that the fact that she potentially could turn her skills to that and show people is a wonderful thing, too, to go alongside the food, you know?

Andrea:
Yeah, the turning a quilt into a jacket thing. What? I know. I need to see one. I know when she shows her work on the Zoom calls, which I think she wasn’t on the last one or two. I think she was working or something. I think she had told us that her shift was going to change. So I miss seeing her on there. And she’s always on there working, sewing something. But I love when she shows us because it just is such professional things you think geez like you made that there’s no way it’s awesome so yeah being able to teach those skills I would like to learn that I don’t know how, yeah okay well if you are listening and you’re um on discord or you can email us and you have ideas for brianna send them in and we’ll yeah you can write to support.

Alison:
An ancestral kitchen podcast that’s where you should um write to and then that comes to one of us and we can pass that information on and.

Andrea:
Um do.

Alison:
All the good things with it.

Andrea:
Okay i have a funny question from rebecca let, now you said she’s in ireland right yes we have had two family groups from ireland camp out here in the last or over the course of the summer i mean what are we doing over where you are then i don’t know just checking out america i guess okay but they they really liked like the sheep roaming on the hills they said they both said feel.

Alison:
Like they were home.

Andrea:
Yeah they said wow i’ve not been anywhere like this in the U.S. Yet. I said probably not. Okay, Rebecca said, a totally silly question. When you’re reading aloud in the evening or reading aloud for homeschool lessons, do you do voices for characters? My throat gets too tired.

Alison:
Do you do voices for characters, Andrea?

Andrea:
Allison.

Alison:
Do I do voices for characters?

Andrea:
Do I do voices? Of course I do, obviously. It’s like the main reason why I read is I look I’m like oh are there any good characters oh yeah yeah uh yeah and does your throat get tired uh I don’t know maybe I do it too much um sometimes I’m tired when I start and I tell the kids I’m just gonna have to read this I’m like really tired when I’m reading school, lessons sometimes I don’t super characterize everything but it’s it’s really hard for me not to it’s like a habit it’s a reflex so how long do you read.

Alison:
Aloud for you know for if you were saying in a normal homeschooling day how long would you have been reading out loud.

Andrea:
Oh that’s a really good question i’ve never actually timed it i suppose it depends on um, Well, as long as people will listen, realistically. But, yeah, like if I read at night, I usually get too tired just in terms of being sleepy, not in terms of my throat getting tired.

Alison:
Okay, yeah.

Andrea:
But during the day, I’m like, come on, kids, sit down and listen. And they’re like, we want to run around. Oh, come on. But, yeah, I don’t have a problem reading for a long time. Yeah. What about you?

Alison:
Well, I don’t really read that much. out loud because I have Rob who does all the reading out loud and I think once again Rob.

Andrea:
Read me a story.

Alison:
Yeah it’s partially just because I want to have a story read to me and that’s just been part of our history he’s always read to me you know when we first got together we were living in different places he just used to ring me in the evening and read stories to me like for hours that and so that’s kind of just been part of our it’s part of our DNA you know our relationship does he do voices he does voices like big he does voices and that’s partially why i mean gable prefers dada reading to him and that’s because he’s always had dada reading to him really yeah so it’s his kind of comfort zone but it’s also because dada just does much better voices than mama just much better you know and and i mean after hearing them a professional voice exactly person yeah it’s.

Andrea:
Literally his job so.

Alison:
That’s why he’s good at it you know he can mimic quite nicely and and after reading i don’t know how many books you know you i’ve got to know a kind of the style of voice and i’ll be like oh that one’s a bit like what you did for moody in harry potter or that one’s a bit like what you did for this and that and and so i’ve got used to the he said there’s only a certain number of voices you know with slight inflections on each one um so yeah he does voices for the characters we’re reading sherlock holmes at the moment he’s got a separate voice with sherlock as he has for watson and then all the other characters who come in and some of them are posh and some of them are cockney and some of them are you know lords and he’s got different voices for all of them it what’s interesting is that i do read to gabriel, um at the moment we’ve got a encyclopedia children’s encyclopedia of oceans published by dawling kinsley that we’re reading through together and also we’re reading um a book that’s about Albert Einstein and it sounds like a story I think it’s called the time and space of Uncle Albert and Albert Einstein is an uncle in it and it’s kind of told from the voice of the of the niece and it explains his theories from a perspective that perspective so it’s perhaps easier for a child to grasp them so I’m reading that to Gable at the moment and I kind of do the.

Alison:
For perhaps to minutes my voice gets tired and I’ve talked to Rob about this many times in the past and I feel like it’s this is where Katie Bowman’s going to come in it’s kind of an alignment thing you know that he’s learned to use his body in a way that is much more efficient because he’s had to because he’s a singer and he’s taught people how to sing and so he’s worked with that, himself on the edge of you know he wants to make this sound and he can’t he wants to hold this and he wants to you know he wants his voice to sound the way he wants it and so he’s specifically worked on it whereas I haven’t really done that I’m just always sung and I just enjoy singing, and so because of that he just he doesn’t get tired because I think he just uses his voice in a more ergonomic I guess is the best word I can use to describe it way than I do and I know his breathing is different to mine I have because of the way that my spine is kind of historically I my breathing’s not optimal the way I use my breathing in my torso is not optimal and I I know if I put my mind to it I could probably make it somewhat better as we talked about in the things you can always make something somewhat better um but I haven’t yet got to it so and because I’ve got the luxury of having someone who reads to me and I love being read to I kind of just leave it to Rob.

Andrea:
Oh yeah why fight it well here’s my question for you Alison then as I was reading your oat book aloud around the.

Alison:
Campfire I thought boy.

Andrea:
Once this comes out they’re going to want an audiobook.

Alison:
Read by.

Andrea:
Alison are you ready for that.

Alison:
I I would love to read it you know i would love to read my own book i’ve always loved when i when i listen to a lot of books on audible and i always love it when they’re read by the author because i just think they can bring things to it that they intended to bring to it that perhaps a narrator wouldn’t um, But I talked to Rob about that and he said, you know what, we’ve got the equipment. We could actually do it here because we Megan Francis told us that she went into a studio to record her book and just like massive, like full on, you know, hours and hours and hours of it. And I thought I couldn’t do that because I’d just get tired. So I don’t know. We’re hoping maybe we could do it here and I can take breaks. That’s my plan.

Andrea:
What was Megan doing like eight hours at a time? I know.

Alison:
I couldn’t do that.

Andrea:
I need to put her book in the show notes. I’ll put it. Megan Francis, one of our listeners, she not only wrote a book, she read the audio for it. Is it out yet? I haven’t looked.

Alison:
Yeah, it’s out. Yeah, definitely. Oh, I don’t know if the audio is out yet.

Andrea:
Oh, yeah. No, the book is out for sure.

Alison:
Yeah.

Andrea:
But I’ll put it in the show notes. And if you’re looking by now, it might be there. You know, there is a book on Audible that I listened to. I have listened to like you many many books read by people and i would say this is the best narrated i have ever heard of all audio books that i’ve ever listened to and it is david copperfield read by richard armitage i don’t.

Alison:
Know who he is.

Andrea:
Well he’s he’s an actor um and i know I know he’s done a lot of Shakespeare, and he’s, I’ll say British, but I don’t know, he’s one of those people over there, now I’m confused about what’s UK and what’s not, but anyways, the diversity and range of his voice on there is mind-blowing, and the way he completely acted and was immersed into each person, just totally blew me away and one of the one of the ladies in um the chat group that i’m in listened to it on audio.

Alison:
While she.

Andrea:
Was driving and she got pulled over because she didn’t realize she’s driving faster and faster.

Alison:
Because it was a really intense part and she said the.

Andrea:
Officer pulled over and she was like crying because of the part of the story and he’s like what’s going on and she’s like i’m listening to an audiobook so anyways it’s kind of funny.

Alison:
But listen to um to the hillary mantel trilogy about thomas cromwell and i remember the the um narrator of that again he was an actor i can’t remember what his name was um but there were lots of reviews there saying oh i don’t like this narration lots of reviews they’re saying oh the narration’s brilliant i was like i don’t know who to believe um and at the beginning, it was really it’s quite an intimate um there’s really you can get some really quite different variations this was a really close to the mic you know really and you could hear everything his lips were doing and I think perhaps for some people that was a bit off-putting but it made it brought the book an intimacy that just was amazing and I think rendered it very differently to if I’d been reading the words on the page um so yeah it’s fascinating how that can make a huge difference.

Andrea:
You know i had told rob about this he said you guys have over in the uk the steven somebody or other reading harry potter.

Alison:
Oh steven fry yeah steven.

Andrea:
Fry yeah and he.

Alison:
Yeah he.

Andrea:
Was not very enthusiastic but i told him we have jim dale in the.

Alison:
U.s.

Andrea:
Who read the books and gary found a video and showed me a video of jim dale talking about how he developed because i mean i can be on the on the other side of the house and I know who’s talking like Jim Dale does such a good job so he showed how he he sat and like developed each character’s voice and thought about you know why they would sound like this how they would sound and then, he recorded it with a producer and so he said he would sit down and he’d read a line and then he might pause and say hey i need to pause and then he would listen to like a i don’t know what you want to call it like a sample tape or whatever of.

Alison:
Himself being.

Andrea:
A certain character to get back into the voice of the other.

Alison:
Character right okay and.

Andrea:
So it’s quite excellent i think and then again you get the same thing like you said some people comment oh this is terrible.

Alison:
Yeah yeah people.

Andrea:
Say oh i love it and.

Alison:
Oh i can’t trust those it’s like amazon reviews i can’t trust the audible reviews don’t don’t read no don’t.

Andrea:
Even look at reviews honestly i think when it comes to reviews i don’t even consider them anymore because there’s just like people have robots and paid paid.

Alison:
Paid machines basically well it’s interesting you know what uh talking about paid machines um from a kind of an ethical point of view um i’m just going to bring this up i don’t know if you had something else to saying but no i’m barging in um naomi devlin has just written a book which she self-published called um bread and it’s a gluten-free bread cookbook and she previously was associated with an institution here in the uk which is run by hugh fernley whittingstall who’s very famous called the river cottage and it’s an actual place his home where he did loads and loads of um food um courses she used to be their gluten-free bread teacher but now she’s not their gluten-free bread teacher anymore and she published some books with them she decided to self-publish her latest book and i know from stuff i’ve read that getting amazon reviews is really quite important and you need to ideally have over before amazon start taking your book seriously and what’s really interesting is that she has a online cookery school where she sells her you know a bit like i do you know she’s selling courses on making gluten-free bread or gluten-free cookies that kind of thing and she offered her newsletter readers a voucher of cooking classes if they left an Amazon review and she.

Alison:
I thought, gosh, that shows just how important Amazon reviews are to an author that someone would offer, you know, like , I think $ or pounds off in their online store for someone to leave an Amazon review. And so, you know, the fact that we don’t even read the Amazon review, don’t pay any attention to them, but they do mean something in the kind of capitalist commercial world, you know, because Amazon will notice your thing, just like an algorithm in YouTube. An algorithm in Instagram there’s a there’s all the different things that make you okay on Amazon or not okay on Amazon I just thought geez you know that.

Andrea:
Yeah I’m.

Alison:
I felt so kind of naive when I was like oh my gosh she’s offering like money for people to write her a review is that is that what the world’s come to now you know but apparently it has.

Andrea:
Right but it’s really hard to get people to make a move you know i know because it’s hard to get me to make a move and and i know we say it we we don’t say it as much as we should probably but you know you hear people on podcasts say leave us a review leave us a review and it’s because you’re literally invisible to the algorithm without reviews which is just absolutely and yeah we know that.

Alison:
From being on this end that.

Andrea:
How hard.

Alison:
It is to get people to leave.

Andrea:
Reviews and they’re.

Alison:
And they’ll write to us saying how wonderful the podcast is and it’s just in our inbox and we’re like but hang on can you let someone else know be really really.

Andrea:
Nice if.

Alison:
You could write us a review.

Andrea:
Yeah we get the most beautiful the most beautiful letters and and they’re long and in depth and and we finally at some point started realizing we should respond and say well i mean we do respond but we realized that we should say could you leave us a review you know just copy paste this or put part of this or yeah something um because, It’s not because we need to be reminded of how good we are, although that’s fine, too. Don’t mind that. But it’s because the most garbage podcasts get put on the front page of things and get listened to by people. And people who are seeking whatever kind of information about food end up on these just trashy podcasts with, like, terrible advice and overproduced and overdramatic stuff. Don’t get me started on it i i know i’m sorry um iacp awards allison but but uh, that and it’s because no matter how good a podcast is if it doesn’t if you’re not hammering people every five minutes and saying leave us a five-star review leave us a five-star review then then you’re you just don’t count which is bizarre so leave us a five-star review yeah so So.

Alison:
Yeah, if you’re listening and you love us, which you probably do because you’re supporting us, we’re ever so grateful for that. Do, if you haven’t, go and leave us a review. That would be really nice.

Andrea:
It is a really, you know, obviously we can’t pay anybody who’s working for the podcast without actual money. But also leaving us a review is an amazing way to support the podcast, as I have learned. And if there’s podcasts you like out there that you’re like, I can’t support them all. Like leave them a good review because it has a huge impact on the podcast no matter how big they are it really helps so yeah leave those reviews which is um like i said something i never think to do and i just need to become more.

Alison:
Habitual yeah so maybe it’s fine for for her to give people a voucher for leaving a review it’s.

Andrea:
Kind of a thank you for them getting off because they’re probably yes they’re probably already would they just need the little motivation to do it yeah and but that’s the other tricky thing is people want to leave a review or they like it or they tell people in real life how much they liked it but without some sort of an impetus they might not be motivated to go do it online where it will help her be seen and she’s right that the amazon machine as we learned from Megan is it’s its own monster.

Alison:
Yeah, because she’s self-publishing.

Andrea:
You’ve got to play the rules. Yeah.

Alison:
She’s doing it all by herself, you know.

Andrea:
Is she somebody that would be worth talking to? I mean, I know we get so many questions about gluten-free bread, and I just don’t know.

Alison:
I tried. I tried. You know, Nicole, who you know very well, lives in Italy, has suggested several times that Naomi Develin and I have a lot in common, and we would probably be really good friends if we met. And I tried to contact her several times, but it just kind of the conversation didn’t work. I invited her to come on the podcast and she said oh i’ll listen to an episode and then she got the kind of wrong end of the stick of what our episodes were and i tried to help and then i didn’t hear anything from her and in the end i just thought i can’t i want to give her some promotion i can’t keep pushing this you know i’ve got other things to do with my life yeah so i kind of just dropped it um but yeah i mean she would be a good she would be a good person to talk to maybe one day i’ll meet her naturally just the fact that she wanted.

Andrea:
To try and listen to an episode before getting on i don’t think anybody ever does.

Alison:
That they’re just like oh.

Andrea:
I don’t care i don’t care what you’re.

Alison:
Talking about sure you can talk to me yeah yeah so that yeah that.

Andrea:
Makes me like her that she was like i want to try and listen to an episode first even if.

Alison:
She wasn’t able to get it done she she kind of has a lot in common with us you know her attitude towards um big wigs and gut and um diversity and yeah she’s she’s a good girl definitely yeah we’ll be looking.

Andrea:
Her up because i’m i’m gonna get to the point where i want to make some bread for myself so i.

Alison:
Haven’t gotten that.

Andrea:
Desperate yet but i’ll get there i’m sure.

Alison:
Yeah yeah oh it’s a it’s a it’s a book that’s definitely worth looking at i would say and leaving a review if you like it.

Andrea:
Well do you speaking of bread do you.

Alison:
Want me to.

Andrea:
Read the question from amy because this is a really.

Alison:
Good yes please do yes please do okay.

Andrea:
So amy posted this in discord she said i’m interested in a wholemeal spelt sourdough and have a question related to this i’ve been using ellie’s whole grain spelt recipe which involves mixing then leaving the flour water and starter for an hour then adding more water and salt then several stretch and folds throughout the evening over a few hours and leave it overnight in the fridge to prove.

Andrea:
In order to give myself time to do it, I start around p.m. And can get it ready to go in the fridge by the time I go to bed. It works great. Sounds like it would be very tasty, too. I’m wondering if it would also work to basically skip a lot of the early steps and mix the whole lot together and then knead it for to minutes instead, then put it straight in the fridge. I’ve seen a recipe in a fermentation book, Asa Simonson, using white spelt flour that does this method. Is the difference between kneading or stretch and folding to do with white versus whole grain? The other reason I’m asking is sometimes I get to the evening once kids are in bed, or p.m., and feel that it’s too late to start Ellie’s recipe with all the time needed for stretch and folds over a few more hours. But I would have the capacity to do a quick bit of kneading before bed. If that wouldn’t work, any other tips or recipes for starting a sourdough whole grain loaf in the evening that would be ready to bake in the morning maybe that’s wishful thinking sorry allison i didn’t do voices no.

Alison:
You didn’t you didn’t do amy’s voice where’s your english accent.

Andrea:
Um well i said all those english words like whole meal and lot whole meal such oh.

Alison:
So many points that i’m probably going to.

Andrea:
Forget to answer this question um this fits really well with Brianna’s too because.

Alison:
It’s quick and.

Andrea:
Easy yeah so.

Alison:
My philosophy basically is that your bread should fit into your life you shouldn’t have to change your life to make bread and.

Andrea:
Wow Alison title of our next episode that is so that is so good you shouldn’t have to change your life to make bread I’m writing it down sorry I think that’s amazing whatever.

Alison:
Your routine is you can find a way to fit making bread into that and make it work always um so yes, There is a way to make sourdough, whole grain, spelt loaf in the evening that will be ready to bake in the morning. It’s not wishful thinking at all. Ellie’s recipes are wonderful. And, you know, she’s got hundreds of them. And I’m sure, you know, when we delve into all of them, you’ll find she uses different techniques in all of them. And probably she swaps those techniques between wheat and spelt and, you know, the other grains that she uses, not being specific to, oh, you have to do this with spelt.

Alison:
There was a question in there about is the difference in kneading or stretch and folding to do with white versus whole grain I would say no I think it’s just that you’ve come across two recipes one that does those stretch and folds and leaving with a lot of time that’s whole grain and one that’s white that doesn’t but there’s no rhyme or reason in that you could apply both techniques to both types of flour so um the first thing i’ll point you to amy is as a um supporter you can get the spelt sourdough cookbook for six dollars and in there are recipes which have a lot of information about timing in them because you know my philosophy is this this has to work for you and i found many ways to make it work with whatever timings i happen to be dealing with So if you haven’t, yeah, it sounds like you haven’t, it might be worth getting that book. There’s a discount code in the, I think in the…

Alison:
Sourdough bread channel in discord um and it was probably in the email that came to you when you first joined um contact us if you can’t find it and i’ll send it um but basically yes very often i do what you’re wondering if you can do which is i will um take my spelt flour in the evening and i will mix in the salt and then i will mix my starter with water stir it in bring the dough together and then put a lid on the bowl and put it in the fridge and as long as it is tightly covered so the air’s not getting in making the outside go hard and dry then that is a perfectly reasonable thing to do you don’t have to have stretched and folded it for several hours or left it for several hours if you want to you can so sometimes I start my loaf at maybe half five, and I’ll stretch and fold it a couple of times before I put it in the fridge but sometimes I don’t have that luxury and it’s been a very busy evening and I’m like oh gosh we need bread tomorrow and I’ll literally just mix it put the lid on and put it in the fridge and then in the morning.

Alison:
I will get it out the fridge as soon as I remember to try and get that loaf to come to room temperature and I will very often pick it up out of the bowl as soon as I take it out the fridge and stretch and fold it to get the warmth of my hands into the dough and to get it moving and sometimes I will move it into a different bowl because that bowl particularly if it’s glass or ceramic has been in the fridge and will take a long long time to warm up so I’ll often get another bowl out that’s at room temperature and put it in that new bowl and then leave it on the surface.

Alison:
And then I will play that proofing and fermenting by ear. So if I’ve done a couple of stretch and folds in the evening, then it’s going to take probably less time that next day before it needs to be panned. But if I put it straight in the fridge, it’s probably going to need quite a while before it’s panned. Now, there is a kind of an idea that you can just do the whole bulk fermentation in the fridge. I don’t find that that generally works for me. I find that generally if I do put my breads in the fridge just before going to bed they do need some time in the bowl to ferment more before I pan them just if anything just to get that bread to room temperature before it goes into the pan but I will use the usual signals and cues that I do on that loaf so I will put it on the surface I will stretch and fold it and then I will put the timer on for an hour and then i will come back to it and i will just make a judgment over that kind of routine again and again when it’s ready to go into the pan um if you want it to be ready to go into the pan more quickly then put more starter in it before you put it in the oven you sorry before you put it in the fridge so instead of for a gram loaf for example, instead of putting grams of starter and you could put grams of starter and then it’s much more likely that that bulk fermentation is going to be more completed in the fridge overnight than it is if you put grams in.

Alison:
Then I will transfer it into my pan. And let it do its proof thing and cook it. Sometimes I make a loaf halfway through the day and I’ve done the bulk fermentation on the counter but it’s taken longer than I wanted it to do and so I will then pan it in the evening just before bed and then put the entire loaf tin covered in the fridge and then bring that loaf tin out with the dough in it the next morning let that come to room temperature. I know some people on Discord put their bread straight in the oven from the fridge I generally don’t do that I will let that come to room temperature and then I will bake it so I just whatever my situation is with in terms of what time of day it is and what time I have available I will find a way for that bread to work now it may not be the most risen bread I’ve ever made you know if I want to make the most risen bread I’ve ever made and i’m going to refresh my starter just before i’m going to make sure i’m keeping an eagle’s eye on it i’m going to probably have a temperature up higher if.

Alison:
I possibly can i’m going to try and do it all in one day but generally that’s not how i make bread and i think most people who follow us just want the bread to be good but available when they want it and as easy as possible and so with that in mind i can reliably get good spelt loaves whether i put the dough in the fridge or have the dough in the pan and put it in the fridge all you need to do is you know just try it once try the idea that I’ve said just mixing it stretch and folding it put it in the bowl put it in the fridge bring it out in the morning stretch and fold it keep an eye on it try and judge when you think it’s right move it to a pan and then cook it and see what happens if you think oh didn’t rise very well I think I under fermented it then maybe put a bit more starter in the next time or maybe stretch and fold it another time in the morning the next time or maybe see if you can do it at seven not nine the night before, you know just whatever there is a way of making bread in the way that you want to in the way that your routine works and don’t feel like just because a particular recipe says that you you have to do it this way that that’s the rule because there really are no rules other than the ones that you want to bring to life in your own kitchen I think amen amen that.

Andrea:
Is that’s Excellent, Alison. And a good reminder back to what Brianna was asking about bread and back to what Rebecca said that just understanding the processes and being able to have your own freedom in how they work to suit your life is so, so important.

Alison:
That’s the thing that’s going to keep it going. You know, if you can’t make the bread in the way that fits with your lifestyle, then you ain’t going to make the bread. That’s what’s going to happen.

Andrea:
Yeah, if it’s a huge, complicated, you know, life-changing procedure every single time, then it doesn’t, yeah, it doesn’t come around that much. It’s totally true.

Alison:
Yeah.

Andrea:
But you know, Alison, that eagle eye bread is the one you post on Instagram.

Alison:
I post on Instagram? What’s that? I don’t do that anymore.

Andrea:
Instagram? Who’s that? Never matter.

Alison:
Yeah.

Andrea:
Yeah, okay.

Alison:
No one sees it anymore.

Andrea:
No, this isn’t a question, Allison, but this is a comment from a conversation you and I were having when we talked about the gifts in our last KTC, and that was such a good conversation and stimulated lots of great comments. Somebody said in Discord that, and Leah said this is what they do as well, that whatever… Gifts the grandparents buy you know they maybe they’ll go to grandma’s house and grandma has all these gifts.

Alison:
Then she says.

Andrea:
We allow the kids to bring one home and the rest have to stay at grandma’s house.

Alison:
And so if.

Andrea:
They want to live in the clutter then they can.

Alison:
Buy lots and lots of stuff cheeky idea i know.

Andrea:
And and then whenever the kids come over they have all these special.

Alison:
Fun new toys.

Andrea:
Yeah so so it’s a total win for everybody but you had a comment that you said oh i wish i’d remember to.

Alison:
Mention and.

Andrea:
I wanted to give you space to say what you were gonna.

Alison:
Yeah I just thought afterwards you know because we we did the recording and there was lots of discussion on discord and I thought oh yeah I just feel like gift experiences are another option and one that we perhaps overlook you know there is no clutter with them and sometimes they can give something that just is so above any plastic toy you know I was I was telling you just before we started recording that my sister took her three children on a boat fishing with some you know guy who arranges fishing tours and and they all caught sea fish and they brought it home and they cooked it and you know the idea of something like that or you know if Gabe was interested in blacksmithing for him to have an experience of blacksmithing one of my nieces is interested in flying I know that’s kind.

Alison:
Of you know something that you’ve experienced but to give a kid um an experience of doing something that just is perhaps not available within their sphere you know there’s things that we that rob and i can do for gable and there are things that we just can’t um so the idea of gifting an experience that’s going to stay with that person forever i love people who um you give me experiences i’ve got lots of memories of you know days out and things we’ve done together so I think that the idea of giving a gift without that kind of stuff thing happening is is one that I wanted to put into the discussion.

Andrea:
I think it’s a great one. And, you know, having a family with a lot of kids, when I was growing up, there was eight of us.

Andrea:
My uncle and aunt, obviously, it could get quite expensive to buy each kid a gift, even if you wanted to. But they were pretty smart. They would get us a membership to like a science center or the zoo or something for the year. So it’s you know for them it was affordable and then for our family it was super exciting because we just couldn’t wait to go to whatever this place is it’s helps with our homeschool and probably something that would about outside of our family’s normal budget and it doesn’t add to the clutter and then for a year you can go and see this museum or whatever it is that your family’s into so if you if you have a family in your life with a ton of kids and you don’t want to buy them all an individual gift to get thrown on the floor and then thrown away uh getting them a family membership to somewhere is super exciting and of course i’m sure that my uncle and aunt talked to my parents first and said yeah to find where’s somewhere reasonable to go and where could you guys actually visit so and then i know a number of moms who ask for like the discord membership or a podcast membership or classes, like in the literary life, people will ask.

Andrea:
They’ll just say to their family members, I just want cash so that I can buy one of the classes. And I know people have used Christmas cash to buy your courses or to ask your family members, say, I want to support this podcast for a year. Give me the money for that. And then you can go in and download all the eBooks and things like that.

Andrea:
So, those don’t add clutter to your life and could contribute in a positive way which is great which is what gifts are supposed to do right like isn’t the whole point of a gift is to help somebody in some way and not increase their stress yeah.

Alison:
Not antagonize everyone around them.

Andrea:
Right right uh somebody i think it was, somebody in the discord said anything with batteries stays at grandma’s house yeah that’s a good idea which i thought was really funny because they’re like i just can’t listen to that noise which is yeah fair enough yeah fair enough oh thank you for bringing that up.

Alison:
Again because um i felt like that that needed more airtime and obviously we can still carry on the discussion on discord if.

Andrea:
People have more ideas people have great ideas in there i mean great ideas so if you just if you’re the grandmother and you are like okay well so you don’t want me to buy stuff what do you want me to get like go ask in here yeah no this is amazing amazing group i have a question for you allison that isn’t listed here another one so over the camp yeah sorry do you have time yeah it’s just a bizarre one so over the camp out weekend one of the moms was saying after she got home, she said, you know, I usually, she said, I’ve always had this like weird postpartum smell about me. But ever since I stayed at Andrea’s, I didn’t have this smell anymore. And another mom said, Oh, that’s weird. When I came home, my husband said, you usually have this kind of like, smell, you know, just like a natural body smell. That was kind of strong, and you don’t have it anymore. So they, they, the theories included that I live in a vortex and whatever else ideas could be.

Alison:
Yeah, that’s possible.

Andrea:
But it’s possible. But I was kind of trying to figure it out in my head because they both eat, they eat the way we eat. So, it’s not like, oh, they got away from processed food. It’s not that. They live outside all the time. So, it’s not that suddenly they were outside. What I was thinking about, and I was going to ask you if you think this is possible today, possible theory for it is do you remember when i did all that research way back and i found you know the way men boost their testosterone is like splitting firewood you know it was kind of the.

Alison:
Funny thing that we discovered.

Andrea:
And then when we tried to find what the similar thing was for females how do we boost our positive hormones it was being around other women.

Alison:
Yeah community and so i wondered.

Andrea:
If it was a hormonal.

Alison:
Change interesting because both of these ladies.

Andrea:
Their lifestyle and where they are they’re kind of isolated from other women most of the.

Alison:
Time but suddenly.

Andrea:
They were surrounded by women for the whole however long they were.

Alison:
Here did their husbands like the new smell or did they prefer the old smell it’s it’s a it’s another clue change yeah so you think if if it was a hormonal thing that the husband would naturally like it because it would complement right his hormones exactly right hmm i think um you might have hit on a theory there although.

Andrea:
I kind of like the vortex one so.

Alison:
I’d buy your hormone one I think that makes complete sense I mean I know that well I don’t even remember what that lady’s name is but that really lady who’s been around and lived with all ancestral tribes and was on the podcast with Corey and Christine who talked about that you know and how the hormones can be guided and health can be brought back by us taking our shall we say um ancestral role um more you know we talked about that kind of um when it came out i think we talked about it on a ktc the idea of doing more of the womanly things actually resets hormones and so that what you know what you’ve just said backs up that, She’d be another interesting person to have on as a guest.

Andrea:
Yeah, if we want to get more letters from people. I’m just kidding.

Alison:
Yeah, yeah.

Andrea:
No, she would be. But it is interesting. And it is kind of a touchy thing to talk about, I suppose.

Alison:
Yes.

Andrea:
But it’s kind of, again, you and I have talked about this too. When the more physical your kind of life is, the more sometimes you realize, wow, I see why they kind of had these categories separated. And then the more babies I have, the more I kind of like, oh, yeah, it’s, it would be very difficult for me to be the one hunting because I’d have to find somebody like I want to go do this podcast, I have to find somebody who can hold the baby long enough for me to be separated. And it’s, and in fact, that was when we. No, I think it’s already in the feed for listeners of this episode. If you go back and see from the end of September, an episode went up in the private podcast. That was me and a couple other ladies that we recorded an episode during the campout. And talk about complicated, getting all of us separated from all of the children long enough to do that. was quite a feat in finding the time that would work for everybody. It was pretty remarkable. That alone told me, you know, in ancestral lifestyles, you know, there’s really you and the baby, you know.

Alison:
Yeah.

Andrea:
In ancestral lifestyles, there’s always a baby, so.

Alison:
Yeah, absolutely.

Andrea:
Yeah. Interesting.

Alison:
Interesting. That’s really interesting. Thank you for sharing.

Andrea:
Yeah. If listeners have thoughts, theories, or have ever experienced something similar, or if you smell funny I guess come to my house I just yeah come to the vortex.

Alison:
Right okay should we call it a day then.

Andrea:
We should that was a lot of questions yeah indeed I like this.

Alison:
I like this.

Andrea:
Me too okay.

Alison:
It was lovely to talk to you.

Andrea:
Lovely as always to chat with you Alison I’ll see you next time now bye bye.